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Who was “Third Rome” ?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Machlud View Post

    Oh! Dear!............................................. ..........
    Have you ever give a look to any ancient jug? There is no special or magical technology there.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Sancta_Lux View Post
      First, what is the "second Rome"?... If you refer to Byzantine Empire, it's Rome, period.

      As for a supposed "third Rome" (which would be the second) it would be the HRE because of its name,its influence all over Europe and more important : the restauration of the "Western Roman Empire" (which I would personally consider as a joke, but anyway).


      So what? Papal states had Rome itself, was it Roman Empire? No. Plus once Ottomans took Byzantium, many of the brains from there ran away to Europe and started the Renaissance.
      The second Rome refers to holy roman empire.

      You are right that Byzantines are same as Rome, both are first Rome, Byzantines as word appeared later in 15th.

      Mehmed II declared himself Kaiser-i Rum after conquering Constantinople and taking it as capital city. Mehmed also had a blood lineage to the Byzantine Imperial family; his predecessor, Sultan Orhan I had married a Byzantine princess, and Mehmed may have claimed descent from John Tzelepes Komnenos

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Mikeesmith View Post

        The second Rome refers to holy roman empire.

        You are right that Byzantines are same as Rome, both are first Rome, Byzantines as word appeared later in 15th.

        Mehmed II declared himself Kaiser-i Rum after conquering Constantinople and taking it as capital city. Mehmed also had a blood lineage to the Byzantine Imperial family; his predecessor, Sultan Orhan I had married a Byzantine princess, and Mehmed may have claimed descent from John Tzelepes Komnenos
        Why the second Rome would not refer to Byzantine empire? And the HRE was existing until the Napoleonian war, so... disappearing to leta "third Rome" is... not convincing at all.

        His ancestor having one Byzantine princess as consort doesn't make her his ancestor as well unless she is her grandmother, mother or such. Claiming to descent from a Byzantine prince without anything beside either. Actually, it looks a lot like those people claiming they have "brightful" ancestors because they have absolutely no legitimacy by themselves on the place they invaded.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Elishar View Post
          Oh , obviously the califate,,they have so much in common with rome,,Haahaahahaahh...
          Sure they do... mass genocidal slaughters, pedistry at the palace, trying to conquer the whole world, mass enslavement.. the Caliphate is the true successor to the Rome that was left behind over 1500 years ago...

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          • #20
            Originally posted by aussieinbg View Post

            Sure they do... mass genocidal slaughters, pedistry at the palace, trying to conquer the whole world, mass enslavement.. the Caliphate is the true successor to the Rome that was left behind over 1500 years ago...
            Not the same purpose either, and still many diferences. I would rather be a slave in Rome than in any muslim empire for the eventuality of bein wel treated according to the Roman laws. Then the level of Rome, concerning technology and their ability to develop is much more important.Rome has probably the greatest influence, with Greeks, on Europe and the world while Ottomans... They do have, sure, but not as Rome still has.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Machlud View Post
              I am not being cynical at all. I am just saying that we learn very little or nothing from history, or if we do we ignore it.
              Erm no you're not, you are contradicting yourself like you usually do

              Originally posted by Machlud View Post
              Nothing, absolutely nothing is learned from History never has been and never will be, if it had this World would be a much different place!!!
              Originally posted by Machlud View Post
              For example:-- the early Egyptians had jugs that spilt not a drop of water when pouring, water was precious, yet I cannot buy a jug type kettle that does not dribble all over the place whilst I am pouring from it. Which part of that is learning from History?
              All that proves is you don't learn from your own history of previous mistakes or you would have spent more money on a better jug type kettle, mine doesn't spill a drop



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              • #22
                Absolutely the Ottoman Empire

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